I was going to call it "The Brittany Maynard dilemma", but i thought it would be tasteless to put her name in the title as she is a real human being and deserves out respect.
For the ones that don't know, Brittany Maynard is a 29-year-old woman suffering from terminal brain cancer who has chosen to end her own life, by her own rules. She has brain cancer, grade 4 glioblastoma. In April, a doctor told her she had six months to live. She might change her mind, but, if she does not and everything goes according to plan, Brittany Maynard's death will occur on Saturday Nov. 1-in her bed, on an upper floor of her Portland, Oregon home, with cherished music filling the room and surrounded by the people she loves.
The question is, what is your take on this dilemma? This is not about her and her decision, we can only understand and respect it, but what is your take in our right to die? Do we have that right or not?
The only thing i can say about her decision is, if i was in her shoes, i would do the exact same thing. I would die by my own rules. I'm not against suicide, but, it's not an easy decision, it should never be an easy decision, and it's one 95% chosen out of fear; but the act of ending ones life is a right we have.
Everyone has the right to die. No one can take that right away from you. But suicide doesn't equals suicide. Someone who is running away from problems by committing suicide is a coward imo. And someone who is suffering through an incurable sickness can die to end his pain. Of course, you have to analyze each case one by one.
If I was near death, in pain and sitting in a bed all day every day, I too would want to die. If there's no hope of recovery, why make someone wait until they die when all they could be doing is suffering?
Personally I'd rather die if I was in her shoes. The idea of living the rest of my life confined to a bed or being in pain doesn't sound like it's worth a few more days or months.
Bremaine: If I was near death, in pain and sitting in a bed all day every day, I too would want to die. If there's no hope of recovery, why make someone wait until they die when all they could be doing is suffering?
Strangely I start to wonder how Jesus would've felt when he was nailed on the cross and suffered along side with other thieves.
I bet most of them would beg to end their suffering at some point and was denied because they're criminals.
The only place where I can see suicide being justifiable is when you're suffering excruciating pain and you're sure you're going to die any minute or soon. In other words, I support assisted suicide. Depression, anxiety and the sorts just fail to corroborate one's decision to commit suicide no matter how severe it might get.
Lol at people saying suicide is for the weak... First of all, if ur life sux so much that you can force your self to end it, then that life might be painfull in a way that you cant even imagen... + its not like its a eazy decision...
People should be the once making the decsion on what to do with their life, even if it means end it...
Legally there is no right to die at least in my country. Morally, well what are morals anyway? Spiritually you can't end your immortal soul.
After many years of soul searching over this subject I have come to adhere to the theory that if you take your life for any reason you will pay the most devastating karmic price imaginable. But I could be wrong as the theory is based purely on neurons popping around in my grey matter.
JiveT: After many years of soul searching over this subject I have come to adhere to the theory that if you take your life for any reason you will pay the most devastating karmic price imaginable. But I could be wrong as the theory is based purely on neurons popping around in my grey matter.
There is no karma. Karma is just another take on the all reward/punishment system. I get the idea behind it, "what goes around comes around", but that is, imo, illogical and quite unjust if we think about it. No one can be accountable for whatever they did in a previous life.
My theory is, whatever we do in this life will be "paid" in this life, not in the next. And if we didn't "paid" in this life, we will have to deal with it in the afterlife, not in the next one. Besides, no one will have to "pay" for anything, there is no reward nor punishment.
But, even so, what do you mean by "pay the most devastating karmic price imaginable"? More than rape? More than killing? That doesn't make a lot of sense... You life is yours and yours alone, you are free to do whatever you want with it, of course that, if you don't have a good enough reason to kill yourself, you will face what you did, you will face that you ended your life stupidly, that you hurt yourself and others because of the equivalent of a tantrum. You will feel sad, depressed....augmented to 100, because it's was not the same as to make someone cry due to name calling, you just ceased to exist for this world.
If people want to kill themselves, I don't think the government should be giving them a hand, but it's also not like they're going to strap you down to a chair to make sure you don't. The difference between waiting 6 months to die and killing yourself is the matter of it being an act. When you die, there are most probably going to be a lot of people left behind who miss you. It's going to hurt your friends and family. You can't really be at fault for what you can't control, but if you kill yourself, that's all on you. I would say that suicide is immoral in all but the most secluded or extreme cases (you either have absolutely no one who cares about you, or ending your pain is a relief to a greater grief than your friends will feel by your death)
On the topic of the legality of it, I don't think euthanasia should be an option.
TheFerg: Calling those with the desire for suicide weak is up there as one of the most uneducated statements I've ever heard.
I agree. People commit suicide (or try) to feel in control of a life that is thrashing around. Perhaps we're not ever really fully in control of our lives. But what's to say that we don't have the right to reserve that feeling in certain aspects? It's like making fun of someone in a cage. A cage of uncertainty sure, we're all in em. But why judge those that feel the bars a bit more than you??
Suicide isn't taking control, it's the easy way out. You're just running away. Sure, everybody has a right to decide it for themselves, but that doesn't mean it is wrong to consider it an act of weakness.
It's a law of nature anyway: the weak die, the strong survive.
Suicide isn't taking control, it's the easy way out. You're just running away. Sure, everybody has a right to decide it for themselves, but that doesn't mean it is wrong to consider it an act of weakness.
It's a law of nature anyway: the weak die, the strong survive.
Suicide IS about control. Its a way of saying 'Its up to me' when you can't make sense out of life. I've seen people jump off a bridge, and the aftermath isn't pretty. Yet I never once thought, "coward" because I can be sympathetic and understand that everyone has a nightmare they loath. It comes with having something you really care about. People are complex beings that need more than just some hindsight judgement. if you won't bother to try to understand why, then why bother judging. Yeah its a sign of weakness, but I wouldn't consider it a cowardly one. It really says more about you. Like some social generated response, not a human one.
But did I call them 'cowards'? I don't see anything wrong with being weak. Hell, accepting your weakness is showing strength.
A couple of years ago, my 15yo cousin heard the brain tumor he once had, returned. He had it once before when he was eight years old and it was a long and hard battle, leaving him almost entirely paralized on the left side of his body. Knowing what he had to face again and thinking of a possible outcome, he decided it was okay. He convinced my uncle and aunt to let nature run it's course. He died not long after that.
Such a decision is strength. But that isn't suicide. That's accepting your situation and leaving it up to nature to decide what happens.
Jumping in a river with a brick around your neck or walking in front of a train, is weakness. Nothing more. Nature and lifedecide when it's time for you to go. Ending it yourself because "boohoo my gf broke up with me and there is nobody else who loves me and I just lost my job so I can't pay my rent anymore and I've been bullied my entire life" is in no way even remotely close to showing strength. It's just an easy way to end your 'suffering', because you can't handle life.
Malucky_Luke: But did I call them 'cowards'? I don't see anything wrong with being weak. Hell, accepting your weakness is showing strength.
A couple of years ago, my 15yo cousin heard the brain tumor he once had, returned. He had it once before when he was eight years old and it was a long and hard battle, leaving him almost entirely paralized on the left side of his body. Knowing what he had to face again and thinking of a possible outcome, he decided it was okay. He convinced my uncle and aunt to let nature run it's course. He died not long after that.
Such a decision is strength. But that isn't suicide. That's accepting your situation and leaving it up to nature to decide what happens.
Jumping in a river with a brick around your neck or walking in front of a train, is weakness. Nothing more. Nature and lifedecide when it's time for you to go. Ending it yourself because "boohoo my gf broke up with me and there is nobody else who loves me and I just lost my job so I can't pay my rent anymore and I've been bullied my entire life" is in no way even remotely close to showing strength. It's just an easy way to end your 'suffering', because you can't handle life.
You know you say that doing suicide is being weak in general without understanding the reasons behind it? Sounds ignorant to me.
If suicide would be "the easy way out" I would have done it long time ago, but I actually fear to be paralyzed, becoming blind or losing one or both hands/arms (legs not so much, a leg or foot can be replaced much easier than a working hand) much more than mere death, and with my luck a suicide attempt would go wrong and result in one of these things.
Malucky_Luke: But did I call them 'cowards'? I don't see anything wrong with being weak. Hell, accepting your weakness is showing strength.
A couple of years ago, my 15yo cousin heard the brain tumor he once had, returned. He had it once before when he was eight years old and it was a long and hard battle, leaving him almost entirely paralized on the left side of his body. Knowing what he had to face again and thinking of a possible outcome, he decided it was okay. He convinced my uncle and aunt to let nature run it's course. He died not long after that.
Such a decision is strength. But that isn't suicide. That's accepting your situation and leaving it up to nature to decide what happens.
Jumping in a river with a brick around your neck or walking in front of a train, is weakness. Nothing more. Nature and lifedecide when it's time for you to go. Ending it yourself because "boohoo my gf broke up with me and there is nobody else who loves me and I just lost my job so I can't pay my rent anymore and I've been bullied my entire life" is in no way even remotely close to showing strength. It's just an easy way to end your 'suffering', because you can't handle life.
You know you say that doing suicide is being weak in general without understanding the reasons behind it? Sounds ignorant to me.
Tell me a good reason for suicide, that isn't weakness?
Malucky_Luke: But did I call them 'cowards'? I don't see anything wrong with being weak. Hell, accepting your weakness is showing strength.
A couple of years ago, my 15yo cousin heard the brain tumor he once had, returned. He had it once before when he was eight years old and it was a long and hard battle, leaving him almost entirely paralized on the left side of his body. Knowing what he had to face again and thinking of a possible outcome, he decided it was okay. He convinced my uncle and aunt to let nature run it's course. He died not long after that.
Such a decision is strength. But that isn't suicide. That's accepting your situation and leaving it up to nature to decide what happens.
Jumping in a river with a brick around your neck or walking in front of a train, is weakness. Nothing more. Nature and lifedecide when it's time for you to go. Ending it yourself because "boohoo my gf broke up with me and there is nobody else who loves me and I just lost my job so I can't pay my rent anymore and I've been bullied my entire life" is in no way even remotely close to showing strength. It's just an easy way to end your 'suffering', because you can't handle life.
You know you say that doing suicide is being weak in general without understanding the reasons behind it? Sounds ignorant to me.
Tell me a good reason for suicide, that isn't weakness?
If you can't succeed at committing suicide, you're an idiot.
Being tortured in gruesome ways, by being captive by your enemy or being a slave. Sickness, that makes you suffer painfully without any possibility for a cure. Fear, for example, jumping out of one of the twin towers, because of being afraid of burning alive.
Malucky_Luke: But did I call them 'cowards'? I don't see anything wrong with being weak. Hell, accepting your weakness is showing strength.
A couple of years ago, my 15yo cousin heard the brain tumor he once had, returned. He had it once before when he was eight years old and it was a long and hard battle, leaving him almost entirely paralized on the left side of his body. Knowing what he had to face again and thinking of a possible outcome, he decided it was okay. He convinced my uncle and aunt to let nature run it's course. He died not long after that.
Such a decision is strength. But that isn't suicide. That's accepting your situation and leaving it up to nature to decide what happens.
Jumping in a river with a brick around your neck or walking in front of a train, is weakness. Nothing more. Nature and lifedecide when it's time for you to go. Ending it yourself because "boohoo my gf broke up with me and there is nobody else who loves me and I just lost my job so I can't pay my rent anymore and I've been bullied my entire life" is in no way even remotely close to showing strength. It's just an easy way to end your 'suffering', because you can't handle life.
You know you say that doing suicide is being weak in general without understanding the reasons behind it? Sounds ignorant to me.
Tell me a good reason for suicide, that isn't weakness?
Malucky_Luke: You can kill^ Suicide is weakness. Fine if you disagree.
That's an answer for what exactly?
I only disagree with your definition of suicide and your supportive reasoning of ignorance.
To you it is. Not to me. But I consider modern day western society pussy anyway.
If you get tortured and shit, find a way to kill your torturer. It's a basic survival instinct. If you can't, you're weak. Period.
And you are the one implying that I consider weakness as something wrong or whatever. I never claimed such a thing.
Do you actually read what you have written before you hit the "Submit" button?`
This "You can kill^" applies in what kind of way to being sick or being afraid of being burned alive? And the people which take you into custody are obviously not expecting you to fight against them, because...? Just between you and me... if some people wants you to torture, then they will find a way. Keep that in mind.
Where do I implied that weakness is something wrong or whatever?
I only disagree with your definition of suicide and your supportive reasoning of ignorance.
To you it is. Not to me. But I consider modern day western society pussy anyway.
If you get tortured and shit, find a way to kill your torturer. It's a basic survival instinct. If you can't, you're weak. Period.
And you are the one implying that I consider weakness as something wrong or whatever. I never claimed such a thing.
Do you actually read what you have written before you hit the "Submit" button?`
This "You can kill^" applies in what kind of way to being sick or being afraid of being burned alive? And the people which take you into custody are obviously not expecting you to fight against them, because...? Just between you and me... if some people wants you to torture, then they will find a way. Keep that in mind.
Where do I implied that weakness is something wrong or whatever?
It applies to not being weak. Pretty obvious, if you ask me. It's also not about them expecting you to fight back or not, it's about you giving up or not. Ofcourse, people who want to torture you will find a way. But do you let em get away with it and commit suicide?
Also, I didn't say that you think weakness is bad. As soon as you call my point of view ignorant, you're indirectly implying that I do. Which is ignorant itself.
To you it is. Not to me. But I consider modern day western society pussy anyway.
If you get tortured and shit, find a way to kill your torturer. It's a basic survival instinct. If you can't, you're weak. Period.
And you are the one implying that I consider weakness as something wrong or whatever. I never claimed such a thing.
Do you actually read what you have written before you hit the "Submit" button?`
This "You can kill^" applies in what kind of way to being sick or being afraid of being burned alive? And the people which take you into custody are obviously not expecting you to fight against them, because...? Just between you and me... if some people wants you to torture, then they will find a way. Keep that in mind.
Where do I implied that weakness is something wrong or whatever?
It applies to not being weak. Pretty obvious, if you ask me. It's also not about them expecting you to fight back or not, it's about you giving up or not. Ofcourse, people who want to torture you will find a way. But do you let em get away with it and commit suicide?
Also, I didn't say that you think weakness is bad. As soon as you call my point of view ignorant, you're indirectly implying that I do. Which is ignorant itself.
I call you ignorant for generalizing suicide as weakness. You get tortured and after that you get killed if you are no use to them. So you kill yourself before being tortured and they get nothing in the end. How is that considered weakness by you?
Suicide is weakness. If you're getting tortured and you find a moment to commit suicide, you also could've used that time to (prepare for an) escape or payback.
That's the difference Natural law: the strong survive, the weak die. And even in such a situation, die with your head held high.
Malucky_Luke: Suicide is weakness. If you're getting tortured and you find a moment to commit suicide, you also could've used that time to (prepare for an) escape or payback.
That's the difference.
Your imagination is pretty limited. They will make sure to not give you any opportunities, if you find one, they beat you down. I don't know how you imagine to fight of half a dozen of people, but good luck on that. Also, there are several ways to kill yourself, while being in custody. I won't give you any ideas though.
Malucky_Luke: Suicide is weakness. If you're getting tortured and you find a moment to commit suicide, you also could've used that time to (prepare for an) escape or payback.
That's the difference.
Your imagination is pretty limited. They will make sure to not give you any opportunities, if you find one, they beat you down. I don't know how you imagine to fight of half a dozen of people, but good luck on that. Also, there are several ways to kill yourself, while being in custody. I won't give you any ideas though.
What about the other examples I've mentioned?
Trust me, if anything, I have way too much imagination. Ofcourse they won't give you opportunities, but that goes for suicide too. And I would rather die trying and if I know I will die, I would try to take as many with me as possible.
If you're captured or a slave, the same applies, but it might take a long time. In case of being captured during a war, I would just endure and try to survive.
In regards to sickness, read back what I told about my cousin.
If you jump out of a burning building, it would still fall under fleeing in an attempt to survive.
I'm starting to get bored, because you are deliberately ignoring what I am saying.
Malucky_Luke:
Trust me, if anything, I have way too much imagination.
You havn't show anything close to that. Maybe you have too much imagination, but it certainly is not bound to reality.
Ofcourse they won't give you opportunities, but that goes for suicide too. And I would rather die trying and if I know I will die, I would try to take as many with me as possible.
Seriously, you have no idea how this works. They knock you out or taser you, then they tie you to a chair and can do whatever they want with you without you doing anything to them. You can try to bite them, they cover up your mouth with tape. Whatever you think you can do alone, then can do it with a group against you. In the end, they will get what they want without you getting any opportunity of objection. I'm done with this part.
If you're captured or a slave, the same applies, but it might take a long time. In case of being captured during a war, I would just endure and try to survive.
The same applies to this.
In regards to sickness, read back what I told about my cousin.
The hill of ignorance turned into a mountain of ignorance. You know there are thousand of different kinds of sicknesses, right? Certainly not everyone shares the fate of your cousin.
If you jump out of a burning building, it would still fall under fleeing in an attempt to survive.
How is jumping through the window from the 70th floor down to the concrete an attempt to survive? Sure, that's a possibility I won't deny, but I won't believe you that every single person who jumped into his death, tried to survive by jumping into their certain death.
Like I said, it's all basic instincts.
Ever heard of fight or flight? Now try to make an educational correlation with the term suicide.
Malucky_Luke: But did I call them 'cowards'? I don't see anything wrong with being weak. Hell, accepting your weakness is showing strength.
A couple of years ago, my 15yo cousin heard the brain tumor he once had, returned. He had it once before when he was eight years old and it was a long and hard battle, leaving him almost entirely paralized on the left side of his body. Knowing what he had to face again and thinking of a possible outcome, he decided it was okay. He convinced my uncle and aunt to let nature run it's course. He died not long after that.
Such a decision is strength. But that isn't suicide. That's accepting your situation and leaving it up to nature to decide what happens.
Jumping in a river with a brick around your neck or walking in front of a train, is weakness. Nothing more. Nature and lifedecide when it's time for you to go. Ending it yourself because "boohoo my gf broke up with me and there is nobody else who loves me and I just lost my job so I can't pay my rent anymore and I've been bullied my entire life" is in no way even remotely close to showing strength. It's just an easy way to end your 'suffering', because you can't handle life.
You also didn't say you weren't, which is what I was initially talking about. Its also not an easy way out, if it were there would be way more suicides..
Suicide IS illogical in most cases in which it happens. Suicide IS NOT a sign of weakness in most cases in which it happens. I was just stating that your lack of empathy towards it is a sign of not understanding of why it happens. Hence why you say, "there's always a tomorrow". Of course there is, its not logical to kill oneself. I was saying that i understand why it happens, despite how illogical it is. That just shows how unbearable it is for that person to live their life. If you can't see this past your own views on life. Then you are a narcissist, because suicide is a reality.